Jump to content

Welcome to Da WAAAGH
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

orks and 5+bs

- - - - -

  • Please log in to reply
168 replies to this topic

#161
Nipo_5

Nipo_5

    Puffball Fungus

  • Grotz
  • 10 posts
Well, based of this thread i tried me some shooty units last night. The two were 10 lootas (in terrain) and 10 tankbustas with 2 bombsquiqs in a trukk. I have plenty more stuff like arty and the likes but just wanted to give these two a swing. The rest of my army was designed to get up and get up fast. My plan was the good old trick of making my opponent choose. Either the trukk full of burnas, the 7 nobs with all the trimmings in the ard case battlewagon, the 30 boys, the shunta mekadread or the two mentioned shooty units. He chose something in between which was perfect for me as he did not manage to take out anything and kill it. So, over to my observations.

My bustas got left alone so they got to do full damage for 5 turns. Oh my lord! 5+ rerollable is really really strong! They punched way over their weight coming in as a 270 point package they killed a decimator first turn, a deredo third turn, killed a rhino and took 9 damage off a contemptor killing it off. That is a hell of a lot of points. Now, these where almost perfect conditions. A smarter and luckier opponent would make them pri 1. Also I got first turn... But, in raw damage and to hit reliability, these are all the anti armour we need:) Of course minus one to hit takes them right down to average I think:( I fear that day I meet that or minu two to hit (WTF!) across the table. The bomb squiqs are amazing. 2+ rerollable (against vehicles) guarantees the hit and with the rest of the profile beeing ace they are a must take. Pack as many as you can take. Mitigates all the stuff that can ruin the ork shooting except for the 18" range.

I put them in a trukk. I backed up all my vehicles with the KFF on bike and that is sooo worth it. Keeps them in play much longer and frustrates the opponent. This gives them something else too and that is a 12" rangebump to 36" (24 +12). That is really gold when it comes to getting to shoot the enemy first turn to clean up some of their anti armour.

To summarize. Take tankbustas, take squiqs, put them in trukks (or wagons if you can afford). Mulitiple threats. They really really mitigate the 5+ we are talking about.

The lootas are another story... Without the tank hunter rule they have the 5+ and suffer the randomnes that is the d3 a piece shot. The range is nice but i just do not find them to be worth their points when you have tank bustas as a possibility. The 5+ to hit is in full effect and at 17 points they are way overcosted for what they do. I had a couple of good turns with them and they did take the last 3 wounds of a helldrake in close combat(!) but they are more of a novelty unit. They might be cool to have a lot of maybe... Like 60. They will obviously do some work;) Tank hunter or the likes would of course change theese guys into what they should be. High risk and high reward long range dakka! Maybe even giving them 2 profiles as suggested in here for more reliable shots:) Their gun is bigger than their body;) (yes, a bit of fluff there;)) The trick with them is careful target selection.

For my 10 I rolled a 5-6 first turn so that was 30 shots. With some good dice that is 5-8 hits. Now that really hurts if you can shoot toughness 6 or lower. Toughness 7 or 8 is not viable and the ap -1 is just not gonna impress a 2+ armour save. You might do 2 damage if you are lucky but you aint forcing enough saves. That is 170 points taking off 2 wounds... On a 3 + to wound this becomes a different story. 6 of them killed fabius bile outright.. So tactics on target selection becomes really important to utilize these guys.

My conclusion on lootas is nope, not yet that is;) I hope they get some love in the codex. They do not need much...

Anyways, just thought I would share one experience with you guys. Results may of course vary.
Im gonna be bold and say that I really think tankbustas as they stand now have the right price.

Now give me a god damn demolition charge possibilty on my commandos, waaaaagh!
  • warhead01, Badfang Brassaxe, Gitkilla and 1 other like this

#162
Badfang Brassaxe

Badfang Brassaxe

    Wartrukk Gunner

  • Boyz
  • 1,690 posts
  • Army Name:Da Perfeshunelz

Now give me a god damn demolition charge possibilty on my commandos, waaaaagh!

+1 to that, kommandos were originally intended as the Swiss Army Machete of the ork war machine blowing stuff up and appearing right where the enemy doesn't want them to - the models have actually got demo charges and tankbusta bombs sculpted into them :bang

So, in addition to the blip tokens mentioned previous post how about treat dangerous terrain (if that's still a thing) as difficult and impassable terrain as dangerous (haven't looked at them recently but I'm pretty sure that at least some of the models still have the climbing ropes).

Chuffed that the tankbustaz seem ok but it sounds like the lootaz either need targeters, more shots or re-rolls (although the last two won't be of any use if they can't hit the target 'coz -2 to hit modifiers).



#163
Skumdreg

Skumdreg

    Runtherd

  • Boyz
  • 284 posts
  • Army Name:Dreg Boyz

Interesting conclusions there. I would love a Big Mek on a warbike but I'm hoping GW might play it smart and bring out some official models. In terms of Tanks Bustas.... They're also needed in my army but again... they're expensive (£50 for just 10 small models never seems worth it to me) and I'm waiting to see if plastics ever come out for maybe £15 or something (I know it's extremely unlikely but I can hope....). If nothing happens by the time out our codex I'll think about making a KFF biker. 



#164
Gitkilla

Gitkilla

    Grot Oiler

  • Boyz
  • 166 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:germany
  • Army Name:Death Skulls

I agree that tankbustas are on point this time. You could argue that the rerolls should also work on monsters but that's the only tiny thing I can think of.

 

With Lootas it's a tough call. Maybe if wound rolls of 6 would have AP -3 instead so they can target beefy units/tanks/monsters? Even with full 45 shots the average would only be 2,5 of these tho. Might be small enough to keep it as a nice bonus.

Otherwise a point decrease would be an idea. Think 14 or 15 points might be where they are at.


Metal elitist & into game/level design.


#165
warhead01

warhead01

    Flash Git

  • Boyz
  • 1,063 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Crescent City FL.
  • Army Name:Waaagh Gor-Gak !

Last edition I started just taking mobs of 5 and I'm probably going to keep doing that. a large mob sound good but just like the burna boys it 10,20,30 or which ever number (mob of 10 or more.) Several mobs of 5 is "better" for more shots in my estimation and it forces the other player to spend more fire power or split dice and you can even pack those in trukks or a wagon and just use it as a bunker. I'll probably stick them in my next list that way put them in s spear head and put 6 mobs in 3 trukks some where safe in the back. But I have no faith in them just yet. If they just hit like burna boys... ( Ah second edition kustom-kombi weapons...  how cool they would be in 8th.)


Kick me! to see da blog! WWWAAAAAAUGH!!!

Takein' yer place at da top uv da Heap!


#166
Gitkilla

Gitkilla

    Grot Oiler

  • Boyz
  • 166 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:germany
  • Army Name:Death Skulls

While 3D3 indeed have a higher chance to roll a single "3" than 1D3, same could be said for "1" and "2".

I would rather play mine in a bigger unit so I can command reroll if I get one shot per modell. My idea was using 12 of them in a trukk and (maybe) 6 of them in a big trakk with big zzap gun. Even if that thing also suffers from BS 5+ with its 3 shots.

 

I seriously think making them 2 or 3 points cheaper per modell would be the best idea.


  • warhead01 likes this

Metal elitist & into game/level design.


#167
warhead01

warhead01

    Flash Git

  • Boyz
  • 1,063 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Crescent City FL.
  • Army Name:Waaagh Gor-Gak !

After seeing the buggy thread I think we need a thread about how to get the most from shooting. 
 


Kick me! to see da blog! WWWAAAAAAUGH!!!

Takein' yer place at da top uv da Heap!


#168
Gitkilla

Gitkilla

    Grot Oiler

  • Boyz
  • 166 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:germany
  • Army Name:Death Skulls

After seeing the buggy thread I think we need a thread about how to get the most from shooting.

 

Well go ahead and open one then :D

 

Interested in what your thoughts are.


Metal elitist & into game/level design.


#169
warhead01

warhead01

    Flash Git

  • Boyz
  • 1,063 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Crescent City FL.
  • Army Name:Waaagh Gor-Gak !

I'll try to work something up but it'll probably be gibberish.


  • Gitkilla and Skumdreg like this

Kick me! to see da blog! WWWAAAAAAUGH!!!

Takein' yer place at da top uv da Heap!