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Orks and Rerolls ?

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17 replies to this topic

#1
Keithandor

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Is there any way for Orks to get rerolls ?

 

After facing multiple armies that have all these bloody rerolls to hit , to wound etc etc I'm green with envy.

 

We can reroll failed charges , but for combat it would be nice.

 



#2
greggles

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Ammo runts allow rerolls.



#3
laughterofgods

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Yes to what greggles said, but basically no.  Many of the Xenos armies don't get rerolls.  It sucks.



#4
greggles

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Honestly they should remove rerolls from the game period.  It slows it down so much.  I was really hoping when they killed "twin linked" we'd just see modifiers and not rerolls.  Much rather just see +1's and -1's and skip the whole having to pick up all the dice over and over again.


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#5
Dim_Reapa

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Twin-linked was fine as re-rolls. Now it just solidifies the utter fucking nerf that is blast weapons. I'm not surprised at the amount of rolling dice (its GW: they'll offload most of their responsibilities to dice rolling) I'm just disheartened to notice that there's essentially nothing else to the game.
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#6
greggles

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I don't know if you have played much 8th...but blast weapons are anything but nerfed.  I'd say they are extremely powerful at the moment, and if anything need a nerf! There is a reason that 'umies is one of the strongest armies at the moment, their artillery blast weapons are devastating.  Absolutely devastating.



#7
killercroc

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Is it any wonder that even after twin-linked was switched to double the shots that Beakies are one of the few armies that still get some sort of re-roll after all of that? The basically made Beakies better, oh and all Ork twin weapons cost more than 2 of the weapons separate so... go figure how I just assume everything comes down to "Fuck 'em, they're Orks"

As for blast weapons, yes blast weapons are good... if you're not Orks. Getting D6 shots on a BS 5+ is never going to cause anywhere near the same sort of damage we use to get. Even on the roll of a 6 you average out 2 hits, but guard average out 3 and Beakies 4, and when you look at the kannon/missile launcher they get a much better deal than we do. So unless you're spamming KMK things like Shokk meks, kannons on battlewagons, and really any other sort of blast are a bit shit. I don't even see the point in a Shokk mek anymore sine average S is 7 and D6 shots is not going to be a lot, compared to the large blast that could take out half a beakie squad in one good blast. 


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#8
Dim_Reapa

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I was thinking more of Orks particularly. But it's pretty obvious to see a curve trending towards gatling weapons. Already faced a dozen punishers and a Macharius.

#9
greggles

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I will agree ork blast weapons being meh, on that we are all in agreement!



#10
Dim_Reapa

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I would have done it that all blasts always hit on 4s, regardless of BS or modifiers (apart from overwatch, or exempt altogether depending on testing). There's still the same problem as with most versions of 40k. It's all about maximised offensive output. There's pretty much nothing else to the game.

#11
The Northern Ork

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But isnt mass maximise offensive output an actual and very viable REAL life tactic.. shock and awe, blitzkrieg, red army armor pushes. et cetera.... It actually reflects well the type of combat that is supposed to happen in 40k. Although their is some finesse with some armies, mainly panzee. But as orks I dont think we should think to much and just cahrge in.. or mass fire everything to bits. So it also stays in the orkoid mentality. 

 

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#12
Dim_Reapa

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Debatable. For some, maximised is for one thing wasteful, and for another, flexibility is preferred. But this isn't reality. This isn't a reality simulator, it's a wargame, and crucially, it's a fictional one with made up concepts, such as close combat emphasis and weapons that are more dangerous to infantry using them than the people they are fighting. There is so much rule of cool, so much emphasis on using cool models and crazy ideas. Why bother with realism?

 

If that's all 40k is going to be, fine, I can get my fix elsewhere. But given the rhetoric in Community I expected much, much more than rolling buckets of dice with very little nuance to it whatsoever beyond very, very basic synergy that other companies do better. I prefer GW's models, but their rules are still not up to par with other games you can play these days.


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#13
det

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...maybe some klan rules could bring us some re-rolls? Not that I love the mechanic, but if it´s there every army should have some sort of taste of it.


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#14
Orkimedez

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Orks are not made for rerolls, at least, not in the shooting.

The better the BS the most you get statistically out of a re-roll even if you reroll less often. Just compare old twin linked with double shoots in beakie and an ork.


Same applies to modifiers. A beakie in cover gets a 50% boost (mind 0ap) while an ork gets just a 20%.

To me the solution to ork shooting does not come from convoluting further the throws (and buckets of dice rolls for the matter) but as I said somewhere already...eliminating the negative modifiers all together.

In my mind, orks direct the dakka into a direction, not to a paticular spot. they dont aim as "per se" and this is portraited into the game with a poor BS. Therefore it is only logical that any hit they get is by pure luck and volume of fire.

Then...why should an ork get modifiers when shooting?
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#15
PhillyT

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Kaptain badrukk allows rerolls of 1"s for flash gits within 6".

#16
killercroc

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Kaptain badrukk allows rerolls of 1"s for flash gits within 6".

Also note that Kaptin Badrukk himself is a Flash Git so he gives himself re-rolls too. So you can fire his gun supercharged without worrying as much, but I mean he also comes with 3 ammo runts so it makes his re-roll buff to himself almost pointless until you take the grots off as bullet sponges... but the option is there!


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#17
toaae

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I'd think for us, more modifiers in the same vein as Ghaz's +1 attack and the WAAAGH!!! banner's +1 to hit would benefit us more than rerolls, or at least showcase that while other armies are more efficient, we're still all about sheer numbers. I will admit that when I saw the change to twin-linking, I had hoped rerolls would be more limited. As such their prevalence, especially in beakie armies is disappointing.


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#18
Gitkilla

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I think for weapons like the BW killkannon and the supa-kannon you should be able to buy a grot crew buffing BS to 4 (only for that weapon). That would do more than adding re-rolls and stay true to the fluff.

 

And even if it's slightly off topic the killkannon could basically be free and the supa-kannon like 10 points since you sacrifice transport and that's what the BW is best for anyways.

I can see how our blast weapons will continue to suck tho.


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