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A Breakdown of ORcs & Goblins 8th


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#1
Midtgaard

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Orcs & Goblins Eighth Edition Style a breakdown of the Greenskins When Warhammer 8th Edition came out, my first thought was that infantry, and particularly cheap infantry, would rock the meta game. With that in mind I chose Orcs & Goblins for my new army. Since then I have played 22 games winning 17 and losing none. In this article I am going to go through the different unit choices and how to build what I think is an fun and very effective Greenskins army. Why Orcs & Goblins love 8th In 8th Edition a lot of things have changed. I don`t want to go through every single thing that has changed, but I would like to talk about some of the major changes that in my opinion make the Greenskins a much more powerful and reliable army than before. Steadfast is the first thing that comes to mind and this rule is probably the Greenskins' new best friend. This change in the rules suddenly makes it very effective to have large units of cheap infantry - which is something this army really excels at. Also the new army selection rules means that you now use percentages when selecting your army instead of numbers of units. This is awesome for Orcs & Goblins, which have loads of cheap cool units and heroes that we used to ignore because they filled up our slots. The Green Battle Plan In 8th Edition the Orcs have become a much better army mainly because of the Steadfast rule, which deals with a lot of the Leadership problems. It is also awesome, that you can now use your BSB re-roll for pretty much every single test. This means that your goblins and boyz will actually be able to hold the enemy in place for a long time - as long as your characters are there to inspire them. I therefore think the main strategy of the Greenskins in 8th should be to have a couple of large anvil units and then flank them with things as Trolls, Big`uns and Squigs. The main units of the Greenskins In 8th edition the Greenskins have a lot of cool units to choose from. But most people still think that the most reliable and points effective unit in the army are the Orc Boys. The boys cost 6 points with the shield upgrade (which I think is the way to use them). For that you get a toughness 4 model with 5+ armor save, the Choppa rule and a 6+ ward save in close combat. Of course they do have Animosity, but I still think they are much better points-wise than most of the core choices in the other armies. This is mainly because of Toughness 4 and the fact that they have big bases. With all those war machines out there in 8th itīs really nice to be toughness 4 with big bases because instead of getting killed on 4+ when hit by your basic Rock lobber. It`s 5+ and instead of the enemy getting 21 hits with the direct hit they get quite a bit less. So in my opinion the Orc Boys are great! There is just one thing. In the Orcs & Goblins army we have a luxury problem. Because even though Orc Boys are awesome for their points and should be a no brainer, they aren't. The reason for this is that we have another basic core infantry unit that I think is even better: Night Goblins. The Goblins cost half the points of the Orcs. Of course they do have one less Weapon Skill, Toughness and are on small bases which makes them die like flies to war machine fire. They also have low leadership and don`t get the Choppa rule. Despite these disadvantages these guys rock! In my opinion they are the best choice because they make better and cheaper anvils than the Orcs do. The synergy of this unit with characters is amazing. The Goblins are dirt cheap because they lack leadership and hitting power, which is exactly what the characters give them. In return the nets of the Goblin unit makes your hero`s a lot harder to kill. I usually run my Night Goblins 38 strong with standard, musician and nets. The reason I only take 38 is that I always add 2 Night Goblin big bosses with Great weapons. For 68 extra points you now have a unit with 8 ranks and an additional 6 strength 6 attacks. This makes them a real danger for elite units as they will often just hold the enemy in place and grind them down. Throw in your Orc character for leadership and even more high strength attacks and you have a fairly cheap powerhouse unit. By now some of you might be thinking "Where are the fanatics?" and you are right to think that. Fanatics are a great upgrade for you Goblins. But in my opinion they only really work on the defensive. And I really don`t want to hang back when playing with the Greenskins. I want to get right in the face of my enemy as fast as possible, as the real strength of the army lies in close combat. The supporting units of the Green Horde The job of the supporting units is to kill the enemy, when they are held in place by the main units or in another way give your army an extra dimension of play. When talking about supporting units a number of great choices come to mind. But the ones I use the most are Big`uns, Squigs and Trolls. Chariots are of course also very nice. But I rarely find the points for them as I would rather have the other contenders for the support roles. Big`uns might look a little weak compared to Squigs and Trolls, but what they bring to the field is consistency. You have a bunch of Toughness 4 models. witch are great at handling being targeted. They're reliable in combat and also bring in another type of support: the Spirit Totem. I never leave home without 30 of these guys with shields and the Spirit Totem. In addition to being a solid fighting unit, the 3 extra dispel dice they generate is pure gold. Also because of the totem people will often shoot at them instead of my much weaker Squigs. Giving the very destructive Squigs a better chance of reaching the enemy line intact. I never take the champion upgrade on these guys as I think it is a waste of points. Trolls have become a very attractive choice in 8th Ed. They now fight in two ranks, are immune to psychology and get their stomp attacks. I Usually run 6 of them in two ranks. I never upgrade them as I think the 50% points increase for the Stone or River troll upgrade are better spent on more Trolls. I would always rather have 6 basic Trolls instead of 4 upgraded ones. When using Trolls, always keep them close to your general and BSB as they will need a lot of babysitting to be effective. Squigs are the new kings of the battlefield. I don`t think any other unit in Warhammer gets you the same amount of killing power at such a low point cost. The downside is that they are very fragile. Be prepared to lose loads of these guys to shooting and magic. One thing I love about them that most people tend to forget is that they are immune to psychology. This means that if your opponent spends his first two turns throwing everything at them leaving the rest of your army to run amok, just go back. When you have lost the main part of the unit simply turn around and go back to where you came from. The enemy then have to spend a lot of shooting and magic to get rid of them down to the last model (if he wants any victory points for them, that is). The Greenskin war machines are actually really good for their points and they all have an area of expertise. The Rock Lobber is excellent at thinning the ranks of light infantry and reducing horde units to more manageable sizes. The Doom Diver is awesome at killing enemy heavy cavalry and is also quite impressive at taking out things like Chaos Warriors and other elite infantry. On top of this it is very accurate and therefore very nice . The spear Chukka is extremely cheap and is a pain for enemy monsters as a couple of these will simply pepper the creature with spears; quickly reducing its wounds. The characters of the Greenskins You might have noticed that characters is the last thing I talk about in this article, and that`s no coincidence. In 7th characters were often what won you games. In 8th I think that has changed. Now the job of characters is to support your units by covering their weaknesses. When it comes to choosing your characters it's pretty much a matter of preference. Some people like to have a bunker behind the lines to boost leadership and cast support magic from a safe distance. That`s not a bad idea. Actually it is probably the best way to do it. But Mork and Grok probably wouldn't approve and it feels decidedly un-Orcish to let my Warboss hide behind the line. I like him in the front line bashing heads instead. When choosing your general I think the obvious choice is to take a Savage Orc Warboss. He is cheaper than his Black Orc counterpart and has an extra attack due to frenzy. In 8th you get to take a leadership test at the start of your turn to ignore frenzy and you can even re-roll it with your BSB. This makes the Savage Orc the best choice in my opinion. When it comes to choosing your BSB I always go for a Black Orc. There`s two reasons for my choice. First of all he has the option to take heavy armor, and he has better Weapon Skill. These things help me keep him alive; because he's so important to the Orcs & Goblins army that`s very important. Secondly he has the ability to stop his unit from squabbling. This makes him the perfect babysitter for my shaman. There is nothing more annoying than having the shaman's unit squabble so that you are unable to cast any spells. Moving on to the Greenskin magic I think that a level 4 Orc Shaman is mandatory. The Waaagh! spell is pretty much able to win you the game if you get it off at the right time. Some of the other spells are also very nice. Combine this with the low casting value of the Greenskin spells and the fact that he gives you +4 for your dispel rolls. I think he`s a no-brainer. As I mentioned earlier I am I big fan of the Night Goblin Big Bosses kitted out only with a great weapon. They add a lot of killing power to your Goblins units for a relatively low price, and they are also great at accepting challenges; thus protecting your more important characters. Another thing they are good at is to manipulate the enemies' charge. If you move him out of a unit the enemy is forced to either change plans or charge him, if they charge they will properly win the combat Thus giving you the possibility of a countercharge. They'll sometimes even enable you to set up flank charges in your own turn if they overrun into your main unit. Greenskins army list When putting together your Greenskin army it's a good idea to make sure you have at least 4 units that are able of holding their own in combat. You should also make sure to have 150 models as a minimum. I don`t want to give any further advice on how to make a list as it very much up to your personal playing style. However I will say that you have to remember that you have to be outnumbering the enemy in the number of fighting units you have, as squabbling will often make you feel outnumbered. Below is an example of an 2250 Orcs & Goblins army as I normally play it just to show you how the things I have gone over looks like when put together. Thanks for reading this article and good luck with your very own Greenskin horde. Savage Orc Warboss: Great Weapon, Armour of Gork, Guzzla`s Battle Brew, Amulet of Protectyness. Orc Great Shaman: Level 4, Talisman of Protection, Nibbla`s Itty Ring. Black Orc Bigboss: Heavy Armour, Tricksters Helmet, Battle standard Bearer. Night Goblin Bigboss: Great Weapon. Night Goblin Bigboss: Great Weapon. Night Goblin Bigboss: Great Weapon. Night Goblin Bigboss: Great Weapon. 30 x Orc Big`uns: Standard, Musician, Shields, Mork`s spirit Totem 10 x Squig Herds 38 x Night Goblins: Standard, Musician, Netters. 37 x Night Goblins: Standard, Musician, Netters. 6 x Trolls 1 x Rock Lobber 1 x Rock Lobber 1 x Doom Diver Total: 2250

#2
brutalis

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Thanks for the input. Lots of useful advice there

#3
Cossack

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This is a fantastic write up. I'm sorry it took so long for me to respond, but your comments are appreciated. I'm restarting work on my own Orc army (see the link in my sig) and was wondering if I should put the BSB on a boar or not (since it comes in the box). This really helps.
<----- "40% WEEDY" (See why!)
40K Orks - see my army...Orcs & Gobbos - WIP for a new league, until the shop closed...Lootas suck - because they do...You play your army, I'll play mine
I think I'll create an 'army use permission form'....... Zzap gunz do not autohit - now with new I WIN BUTTON!!!

"I just print out cossack's posts on plasticard, and slowly fashion them into deff dread's over time, and then kill things with them." - greggles
"yey my forum hero is back, welcome back cossack! been boring around here without you." - Big Lone
"And Cossack is the NICE one here!" - Shabbadoo
"I gotta agree with Cossack. Go back to your friends, and tell them that Orkz are indeed broken, but that you'll continue to play them because they're absolute beasts, the likes of which have not been seen in years. Then tell them how delicious their tears are and that you'll be using them to fuel and lubricate the emerald warmachine that is your WAAAGH!" - Boss Gobbstompa

#4
Mik McMok the Mek

Mik McMok the Mek

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thanks for that writeup. I havent got the new book yet..but soon hopefully. I love my night goblins but personnaly i would go for the fanatics, If you want to attack with the goboos fire them to the flanks and rear to protect them rather than forward. This way they arent in your attacking arc but are still useful. What about spider riders. Got to say i like mine. And of course the giant, who with high leadership can be used effectively to lure opponents to charge and leave themselves exposed.
When all else fails Panic
If that doesnt work...then you know you are up to your neck in it!

#5
Grimskul25

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Er Cossack, a bit of threadomancy you did here. Besides this is a little outdated with the new book, though it still gets the consistent main points of an OnG army so well done nonetheless.
My advice to you is to get married, if you have a good wife you'll be happy; if you get a bad one you'll become a philosopher.


#6
Cossack

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Sometimes I swear my dead father is on these forums, logging on from Heaven to continue raising me. This is not "Threadomancy". The damn thing was about ten from the top, completely topical and only had one tiny little reply. I thought I'd be kind enough to at least respond to the guy since he put the effort into writing a great article. Anyway, welcome to my ignore list. I wish the OP would come back. I hope he hasn't given up on us for not responding enough.
<----- "40% WEEDY" (See why!)
40K Orks - see my army...Orcs & Gobbos - WIP for a new league, until the shop closed...Lootas suck - because they do...You play your army, I'll play mine
I think I'll create an 'army use permission form'....... Zzap gunz do not autohit - now with new I WIN BUTTON!!!

"I just print out cossack's posts on plasticard, and slowly fashion them into deff dread's over time, and then kill things with them." - greggles
"yey my forum hero is back, welcome back cossack! been boring around here without you." - Big Lone
"And Cossack is the NICE one here!" - Shabbadoo
"I gotta agree with Cossack. Go back to your friends, and tell them that Orkz are indeed broken, but that you'll continue to play them because they're absolute beasts, the likes of which have not been seen in years. Then tell them how delicious their tears are and that you'll be using them to fuel and lubricate the emerald warmachine that is your WAAAGH!" - Boss Gobbstompa

#7
big mek tank krusha

big mek tank krusha

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Sometimes I swear my dead father is on these forums, logging on from Heaven to continue raising me.This is not "Threadomancy". The damn thing was about ten from the top, completely topical and only had one tiny little reply. I thought I'd be kind enough to at least respond to the guy since he put the effort into writing a great article.Anyway, welcome to my ignore list.I wish the OP would come back. I hope he hasn't given up on us for not responding enough.

yaeh, sadly the shamans cave isn't visited enough to push old topics from the front page like the meks garage or goff fortress. personally i'd only class it as threadnomancy if you have to go digging to find it.plus he didn't exactly do much to get on your ignore list - threadnomancy gets chucked around for anything over a month old, and he wasn't having a go at you for it, just mentioning it, so lighten up, eh?

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the proppa way to loot a bastion!

mechanical nids in the FBH!

4th Edition Orks in 7th W/D/L: 7/0/3

7th edition Orks W/D/L 4/0/0


#8
Cossack

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Yeah actually I didn't even notice how old the thread was...it was right there on my screen. Sue me. Oh, and welcome to my ignore list. Just kidding!
<----- "40% WEEDY" (See why!)
40K Orks - see my army...Orcs & Gobbos - WIP for a new league, until the shop closed...Lootas suck - because they do...You play your army, I'll play mine
I think I'll create an 'army use permission form'....... Zzap gunz do not autohit - now with new I WIN BUTTON!!!

"I just print out cossack's posts on plasticard, and slowly fashion them into deff dread's over time, and then kill things with them." - greggles
"yey my forum hero is back, welcome back cossack! been boring around here without you." - Big Lone
"And Cossack is the NICE one here!" - Shabbadoo
"I gotta agree with Cossack. Go back to your friends, and tell them that Orkz are indeed broken, but that you'll continue to play them because they're absolute beasts, the likes of which have not been seen in years. Then tell them how delicious their tears are and that you'll be using them to fuel and lubricate the emerald warmachine that is your WAAAGH!" - Boss Gobbstompa

#9
mosk

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Rather than bicker about threadomancy, lets start updating this. I have not played enough games yet, but I do not feel that the squigs are as good as they were before our new book. I also feel that Common Goblins got a boost as well. Now you may argue that night goblins are better (and I may agree with you) but, lets just look at them. Sure they may be .5 - 1 point more expensive than night goblins, for -1 Initiative, but they have +1 Ld, light armor, and you can give them shields. Also nasty skulkers, are nasty I think. I do not care so much for the lower I as my main opponent are elves, so I am always going to be striking after them anyways, and against most armies we do strike after, so I would rather have higher armor for more survivability, and high leadership because Gork and Mork do not shine down upon my dice rolls, (or maybe they do and they are getting a laugh out of it) I think that before this new edition book people would never even look at Common Goblins unless they are on wolves. Now I think they are a viable option. Though I still may go for Night gobbos, but the above should be considered IMO. Also I feel that the Doom Diver is worth taking 1 or 2

#10
Grimskul25

Grimskul25

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Just to add onto what mosk said, one particular good thing about Nasty Skulkers is that they're a much more viable option than champions for gobbos since at the same points, Skulkers get ASF, Armour Piercing, 2HW and Killing Blow on the first turn! I think one of the main things that are turning people off common gobbos is probably their models. Now YMMV but as far as I have seen on various forums, Night Gobbos generally seem to be liked more both in terms of tactics/effeciency as well as aesthetically. Another obvious change is the buff towards Savage Orcs. Not only have they gotten fantastically nicer (and plastic) models but are much more viable this edition due to much easier ways of handling frenzy thanks to Inspiring Presence and BSB's, as well as some new equipment such as the Lucky Shrunken Head, they can get much more survivable by getting their 6+ ward save to a 5+. Add in the much lessened cost upgrade for Big 'Uns (only 2 points!) and you've got a core unit that can go toe-to-toe with many other core and some special units as well. Boar Boyz got a lot better through a significant drop of 6 points a model (I think), along with the choppa rule effectively making our spears lances (1+ strength on the charge along with the +1 strength for the choppa rule) and the big un' upgrade makes them even nastier. SO Boar Boyz are about the same, except where Boar Boyz are a mix of offense and defense, SO Boar Boyz are essentially all about offense, with a special rule allowing them to keep the extra attack bonus from 2HW, allowing them to have 3 S5 attacks from themselves and an extra S5 attack from the boar on the charge. Goblin Wolf Chariots got significantly better thanks to their dirt-cheapness and change to allow 1-3 Wolf Chariots to count as a single Special Choice. Even if they got shot up, the fact that you can field so many as well as cost-effective chariot impact hits makes up for their weak armour save and durability. Black Orcs got a bit better thanks to a deduction by 1 point in cost and giving us ITP. Generally I'm thinking if you're running BO you want them to use their S7 great weapons to good use and give them the Banner of Eternal Flame or Standard of Discipline. This way they can hunt down Monsters like Hydras and get rid of their pesky regeneration saves, or have a Character with them and gain LD10 due to the SoD and if the character has Crown of Command you have a great anvil unit. Any ideas on the Special Characters? With the big cost reduction in Big 'Un costs it seems like Gorbad is going to make a big comeback, especially since now his Inspiring presence is permanently 18".
My advice to you is to get married, if you have a good wife you'll be happy; if you get a bad one you'll become a philosopher.


#11
Cossack

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All's good, Grimskul. And thanks for updating the thread, mosk. I picked up the book today - nice! It's really not MUCH of a change, but just has little tweaks here and there. My current painted force went from 999 points to 957, and I think it's a little bit better due to the Choppa rule. At first I was a tiny bit miffed over Orcs going up a point, because that's what I want to focus on for my army. But they are better - wouldn't you pay +1 point for the Choppa rule? I would. So I think it works out better. What to paint next? I have no idea....yet
<----- "40% WEEDY" (See why!)
40K Orks - see my army...Orcs & Gobbos - WIP for a new league, until the shop closed...Lootas suck - because they do...You play your army, I'll play mine
I think I'll create an 'army use permission form'....... Zzap gunz do not autohit - now with new I WIN BUTTON!!!

"I just print out cossack's posts on plasticard, and slowly fashion them into deff dread's over time, and then kill things with them." - greggles
"yey my forum hero is back, welcome back cossack! been boring around here without you." - Big Lone
"And Cossack is the NICE one here!" - Shabbadoo
"I gotta agree with Cossack. Go back to your friends, and tell them that Orkz are indeed broken, but that you'll continue to play them because they're absolute beasts, the likes of which have not been seen in years. Then tell them how delicious their tears are and that you'll be using them to fuel and lubricate the emerald warmachine that is your WAAAGH!" - Boss Gobbstompa

#12
lordmetroid

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I miss the magic items of the old 7th edition armybook. With the severely limited selection of magic items, I can no longer make my Night Goblin Heroes and Warboss the characterful charcters that they once were with all the very backstabbing goblin rules. I hate that and I would gladly trade my Mangler squigs for the magic items.