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waaagh! da orks are in da hive

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#1
waaagh5744

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I found this on wargamer au
waaagh! da orks are in da hive

#2
Klawgut

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Dis is only zoggin amazin. Da boys gettin ta krump da squishy umans in da hive and evryfing. I wants me sum o' dat scrap!! WAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGHHHH!!!!!
"DAKKA DA CHOPPY STUFF AND CHOPPA DA DAKKA-IE STUFF!! WAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!" Warboss Klawgut





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#3
waaagh5744

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I got sum 'udda rules here to clicky

#4
Dim_Reapa

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I found this on wargamer au
waaagh! da orks are in da hive


Congratulations Waaagh, you found what I could not. The Ork Gang Rules from Gang War 1! A very nice find, and speaking of nice finds:

I got sum 'udda rules here to clicky


Again, well done. This is to my eyes the largest collection of Necro PDFs from the old Specialist Games site. I have a few more useful links in the pinned resource 'Welcome To Da Hive' (found in this ere section), and I hope you don't mind, but I have added your links to that pinned thread. Fact is, those who visit it will find your links even if this thread ever manages to exit the first page. I've also credited you with the finds that I wish I'd found first.

But thank you. At home, the only Gang War I don't have a hard copy of is the first one, and I wanted it mostly for the Ork Gang rules.


On an unrelated note, I am working on some Ork Gang rules of my own which will be more up to date with Orks. I do like the charm of them all having bolters, but I'd like to add more Orky goodness whilst making the rules a bit more balanced too. There are a number of differences, but I have thought identical lines on the Teef system, which is quite hilarious, although it was in Gorkamorka, so no surprise really.

It would have been finished by now (although I have enough for some previews at a non-too-distant point) but as some of you may know I've been working on the Rebel Grot Codex for the Klanz Projekt for quite some time now, and it has been consuming most of my rules writing time.

Anyway, great finds.

#5
DEBO

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I've been using the rules in the OP - there are some ideas I like, but overall I have found them wanting. The recruiting section mentions paying squigs, but this isn't elaborated on anywhere I could find - which is a shame since it might fix the economy. Long story short, after 3 battles my entire gang is starving and I have a bunch of teef I can't spend unless I lose a ganger for the next battle so I can roll on a random table, which could kill the ganger. I intend to play them to the bitter end, and they might come good if they can survive, but even then I'm thinking of looking for alternatives and starting fresh.

#6
Gobbla

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It's not unusual for an unofficial gang to have rules that don't really work well (or at all). The play testing is suspect, to say the least. I once managed to contact a guy who got his unofficial gang in Gang War magazine, I had some questions. Many years had passed, and he did not know why he had written the rules in a certain way, it probably sounded cool at the time. He had also never played the gang, and probably had limited experience with the game. On the other hand, I helped Jake Thornton with the Scavvy rules he wrote, which are official. He used some of my suggestions, but it was almost all his own stuff, and much of it was dictated by the new Scavvy model releases. All of it was rushed, and none of it was play tested. Iíll bet he hadnít played Necro since the studio play tested the original game. Bottom line is you may as well feel free to fix the rules so they work.

#7
Dim_Reapa

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I hate to say it, but Gobbla has a point. My published Culexus Assassin rules for Inquisitor came as a shock to the system, because I'd forgotten I'd wrote them, let alone submitted them. Never playtested and wrote out in an hour, and still less boring than the conclave offering.

However, just because things aren't playtested doesn't mean the writers don't know what they're doing, or just because something is playtested, doesn't mean it's any good either. There is no rule of thumb here, and what Specialist Games did was publish clever and interesting stuff a lot more than well balanced stuff. A lot of the 'well balanced' and 'playtested' stuff I've read on the internet has been rather boring, for the most part.

I'm writing some Ork Gang rules for the waaagh and it is unlikely I will playtest them. I feel I know enough about the Necromunda rules system to do a decent job, and that's what a fair amount of submitted works are like. They work well usually because a writer knows their rules, not necessarily because they've tried it out.

However I have to say, after initial excitement, and reading through the article, it's not that great, but then it's outdated anyway and screams for some forum rules. I am working on that, but don't let me stop you working on your own in the mean time. I'm not a quick worker.

#8
Gobbla

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Just to be clear, I'm not trying to say untested rules means ignorant writers. And, play testing does not always solve issues, either. But, unofficial rules often have pitflalls the writer simply did not see coming. Heck, offical rules can have pitfalls, too (Think WFB Orcs, which are rife with untested and unworkable rules). The point is that if the rules don't work, fix'em.

#9
Dim_Reapa

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Just to be clear, I'm not trying to say untested rules means ignorant writers. And, play testing does not always solve issues, either. But, unofficial rules often have pitflalls the writer simply did not see coming. Heck, offical rules can have pitfalls, too (Think WFB Orcs, which are rife with untested and unworkable rules). The point is that if the rules don't work, fix'em.


100% agree.

#10
Borrok

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Couldnt some of the necromunda pitfalls be fixed by mixing in gorkamorka rules? Seeing as they both follow similair formats.
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#11
Dim_Reapa

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Similar but not the same. The Teef system is almost indistinguishable and the weapons would need severe adjustment. However I am certainly using aspects of the Gorkamorka system in my own Ork Gang Rules, but it all needs horrendous tweaking. Plus the main issue I have with most Necro-Ork Rules is the assumption that you can easily hire more Orks. It isn't very fluffy imo.

#12
Borrok

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Heres a question, how would the orks work in necromunda lore, surely once the upper hives heard of a potential ork infestation, wouldnt they send the beakies/'umies to purge the underhive or somthing? You know the whole ork seed breeding thing, eventually there would be enough to topple the hive right? Acctually im not helping, I'll leave now (goes back to scrap mine :whip )
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#13
Dim_Reapa

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Heres a question, how would the orks work in necromunda lore, surely once the upper hives heard of a potential ork infestation, wouldnt they send the beakies/'umies to purge the underhive or somthing?


That is rather unlikely. Although one of the richest hive worlds, there are literally millions of Imperial Worlds, and seldom do beakies come so eagerly to the rescue. Most of the time there are far more important and dangerous threats, so infections have to be investigated by the Inquisition before the Emperor's forces are sent in. Besides, the Imperium isn't very efficient and most will write off the merest possibility of Orks in the underhive as impossible (much like some of the 40k Fluff nuts).

Besides, the Hive has been overrun by many beasties before (several Zombie Plagues) and usually the populous is fighting it on its own and on occasion the Nobles send the planetary defence force. The spire of the hive is defensible from itself, so really they're unlikely to ask for help until they're defending themselves from the invaders.

Most likely though, it'd be down to the inhabitants to fight whatever emerges from the Underhive.

You know the whole ork seed breeding thing, eventually there would be enough to topple the hive right?


The term is sporing. In the dark, disgusting and already exotic conditions of the sump and the lower underhive (the highest in the hive really that orks could spore 'safely' (well, safely away from humans) are not ideal conditions for sporing. It would be hard to completely remove the Orkoids from Necromunda fully, but it would be difficult for them to spore enough to topple the hive.

Plus at the hive bottom, there's lots of pollution and other exotic creatures: giant spiders, milliasaurs, ripper jacks, giant rats, bats, sludge and just about anything you wouldn't like to meet. There's lots of competition for existence, it is wholly dark (which is not ideal for sporing) and the humans are as keen to control the population of these creatures as ever.

I wouldn't rule out the possibility of loads of Orks overrunning the hive (the threat of it makes a great campaign setting), but as always with the 40k setting, every aspect of humanity sits on furtively on the edge of disaster. But then who would take over? Chaos, Nids (Genestealer Cults) and Orks all could, but they tend to fight amongst each other and enough of them get killed by the gangs fighting for supremacy in the underhive. Remember that Necromunda produces huge amounts of weapons, and enough of them get used there alone.

#14
Borrok

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So... slightly off topic, If there were enough orks to topple the hive, do you think that would be included as a campaign in 40k or Necromunda? (Just thinking if we are talking necromunda, maybe add it as some custom senarios in the rules?)
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#15
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So... slightly off topic, If there were enough orks to topple the hive, do you think that would be included as a campaign in 40k or Necromunda?

(Just thinking if we are talking necromunda, maybe add it as some custom senarios in the rules?)


That's up to you. GW are unlikely to develop Necromunda any further (and if they do it will be unlikely to be related to aliens when they'd try to promote the gangs) and it is fairly doubtful that it would enter into 40k either (because terrain would be a big issue).

But anyone in the hobby can and will develop their own ideas and some can be found on the internet. A large campaign with Ork Involvement isn't part of my own personal grand plan (although I plan two separate sets of Ork Gang Rules) but anyone can have a go at that, and if they do, they should post it up here, and I'll stick a link to it in my pinned thread.

Incidentally there is a thread for random Necromunda Questions

#16
Bugsquasher

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Is the outlaw rules the ones you would use for orks and bugs, me and my friend want a go at this so? a little off but i figured a good place to ask
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#17
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Is the outlaw rules the ones you would use for orks and bugs, me and my friend want a go at this so? a little off but i figured a good place to ask


Once again, I should emphasise that there is a place to put Random Necromunda questions, my Necromunda Guru Thread which is really just a place for people new to Necromunda to ask experienced players like myself about the game. Although I started the thread, I'm not always the only person answering the questions.

Anyway...

With Orks, it is a little bit complicated, but it depends on what rules you use. You can use the rules as above, in which case you will need to use the Outlaw Rules to run them, although the above ruleset isn't great, and most of the alternative Ork Rulesets online (such as the ones I am writing) will use those rules too.

You can get around this by using Goliath gang rules for Orks, although I'm not a huge fan of it as in my view, Xenos should always be Outlaws. It doesn't matter though, because players will want Ork Gangs outlawed as soon as possible regardless of the rules. Personally for now, I'd advocate taking Goliaths for your Orks than using the ruleset linked in this thread (at least the rules for Goliaths are more or less complete).

There is a thread going at the moment discussing Golisths as Orks.

As for Nids, that's a little more difficult, but possible. Your best bet is getting your gaming group to accept the Genestealer Cult rules from an old Gang War magazine. It will mean converting some human models for the majority of your gang, but if your Nid player hasn't got the Genestealer models handy I'd be deeply concerned. A patriarch is essentially a Broodlord, so use that model. Your purestrains, that's easy, they're normal, everyday genestealers.

As for the hybrid stuff, it's a bit more tricky but very doable. The Magos/Magus is in appearance a normal 'umie psyker. A Imperial Sanctioned psyker/converted fantasy wizard/Imperial Priest with a staff is ideal here, just paint his eyes red. Brood/Blood Brothers are also essentially human, I can't remember if they need their eyes painting red or not, but it can't hurt. Robes are best for these, but any humanoid models will do.

The Hybrids are best converted from human models with extra arms attached from genestealer sprues. They carry weapons, and they only really need the odd genestealer arm. Their faces are usually warped and such, and you can get old hybrid models but they can be tricky to get.

I've never encountered full Tyranid rules, but the reason is obvious. The genestealer rules though should be ideal, and yes, they are usually outlaws (especially if you use your Genestealers a lot).