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Thoughts on our different flyers?

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28 replies to this topic

#1
Gorfang

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So I'm interested to hear people's takes on our 3 similar jets. I admittedly quit 40k shortly after flyers became a normal battlefield unit so never really had to experience the joy of getting mowed down by tin'ead flyers while fielding our underwhelming airforce. This time around we look to have some pretty cheaply costed flyers that can throw around either a ton of shots or mortal wounds. Overall flyers look to be able to absorb many more hits than they used to but will be hit far more often so I guess that's a fair trade.

 

Dakkajets will be able to push out up to 18 shots at decent BS"4" so long as they all choose the same target. 150 points for 18 S6 shots seems pretty decent. The closest firepower I'd compare it to is lootas, although I feel that lootas firing 10d3 S7 deffkannon shots at D2 would be better.

 

Blitzabommers have the best bombing potential with mortal wounds on a 4+ but the fewest guns. I find myself most drawn to this option, as 134 points is not that hard to make back when bombing heavily armored foes.

 

Burnabommers exchange slightly better weaponry than the blitzabomber but for a worse bomb. Overall I just don't see this trade worthwhile and would almost assuredly take the blitza-bommer instead.



#2
warhead01

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The Blitzabommer has made it into my first list because it looks more effective than the other for it's points. Unless I'm mistaken you don't roll to hit with bombs.

It does lots of mortal wounds, good against vehicles too. It's too early for me to tell about the rest of them.  


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#3
PhillyT

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I have a blitzbomma/brunabomma combo and a dakkjet.  I like the reusable effectiveness of the dakkajet.  I'll probably use both in 2000 point games though since they are really pretty effective.  I need a better look at the flyer rules before I make a commitment!

 

What was with the kustomblasta style flier?  Did I just imagine that thing?  Was there a fourth flier?



#4
Gorfang

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Ha right you are! I'm not sure why I left out the Wazbom Blastajet. Perhaps because it's a vehicle that relies on orky ballistic skill to get the job done but without the high rate of fire to have success. Now admittedly I tend to skip over the mek nonsense weapons as they tend to be more trouble than they are worth, but hopefully someone proves me wrong

#5
PhillyT

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When did they introduce that?



#6
warhead01

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Sometime last year. I've used them. I like them. I think it's 190+ points in New Hammer. and rolling to hit is..not so good.

I'm also not sure I like the Smasha Gun now. 


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#7
CannibalBob

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It is probably worth pointing out that the Dakka Jet gets a bonus to hit if all of the supa-shootas target the same unit.  Given the poor Ork BS, that is nothing to sneeze at.


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#8
Gorfang

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Indeed Bob, I included that as the perk of the dakkajet and its BS "4".



#9
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Dakkajets will be able to push out up to 18 shots at decent BS"4" so long as they all choose the same target. 150 points for 18 S6 shots seems pretty decent. The closest firepower I'd compare it to is lootas, although I feel that lootas firing 10d3 S7 deffkannon shots at D2 would be better.

 

 

This is a fair point.  However, it is worth pointing out that there seems to be a large cost difference between a DakkaJet and 10 Lootas.  If you use the power level then the Dakka Jet is pl-7 and 10 Lootas is pl-12.  If you use the points matrix then it appears that a Dakka Jet will cost 128 points and 10 lootas will be 170.  I think the Dakka Jet comes out pretty good in comparison for the cost.  I have not read the flyer rules in the book, but the Dakka Jet is probably still a very good interceptor while also doubling as a fair anti-infantry platform.


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#10
Kalpa

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Wazboms are great, inho. Because they do not suffer penalties from using Heavy Weapons (as is the Smasha Gun), so although it's a 1/3 chance to hit the target, you're using two dice when wounding the target. The most probable roll on a 2d6 is 7, and most multi-wounded targets out there tend to be 8, so it's pretty possible to wound something with the Smasha Gun. Considering it's AP-4 and does D6 damage, this weapon shines against those type of models. It could also be pretty nasty against multiwounded models with a somehow low Toughness value, like Nobz, Tyranid Warriors, Ogryns, and the like. 
The Wazbom Mega Kannon is like a downgraded version of the Kustom Mega Kannon, albeit it can be as dangerous to the bearer as the KMK. So yup, that's no so good. But Smasha Gunz are, specially in Mek Gun batteries. 


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#11
Gorfang

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This is a fair point.  However, it is worth pointing out that there seems to be a large cost difference between a DakkaJet and 10 Lootas.  If you use the power level then the Dakka Jet is pl-7 and 10 Lootas is pl-12.  If you use the points matrix then it appears that a Dakka Jet will cost 128 points and 10 lootas will be 170.  I think the Dakka Jet comes out pretty good in comparison for the cost.  I have not read the flyer rules in the book, but the Dakka Jet is probably still a very good interceptor while also doubling as a fair anti-infantry platform.

My math was assuming you were taking the extra 2 supashootas bringing you to 148 points and 18 shots. Yes, 10 Lootas come out to 170 points, so let's say we take 9 Lootas instead for 153 and 9d3 shots, averaging 18 shots as well. So the math comes out to hitting on 4s for S6 vs hitting on 5s for S7 and 2 damage. Supashootas end up better vs any single wounded models of S5 or less whereas deffkannons are better vs everything else.



#12
CannibalBob

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That is fair.  Although a handful of Lootas are pretty easy to kill via shooting even if they are sitting in cover.  Small units will also have to be wary about the new morale rules.  And a static unit like this is unlikely to be close to the morale-boost tools that we have such as big mobs, nobz, etc.  The Dakka Jet has T6, 12 wounds, and -1 to be hit from non-flyers.  None of that is anything to sneeze at on the cheap package it is in.  I am not sure that these things are competing for exactly the same role.

 

Besides, one of them is a bunch of low down untrustworthy thievin gits playing with guns they probably stole from the rest of the lads and the other is a high-flying high-octane piece of orky know-how loaded down with more dakka than you can shake a snotling at!


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#13
Gorfang

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I'm totally fine if the jet turns out to be quite good. I don't have one yet and they are pretty models that look like they'd be fun to paint, whereas I already have 20 painted lootas. My vehicles seem to be painted akin to T34 Steppes camo, so maybe my jets would be MiGs
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#14
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I'm totally fine if the jet turns out to be quite good. I don't have one yet and they are pretty models that look like they'd be fun to paint, whereas I already have 20 painted lootas. My vehicles seem to be painted akin to T34 Steppes camo, so maybe my jets would be MiGs

 

I am not trying to sell the Jet as being better than Lootas.  But I also don't think it is worse.  I also don't think they are quite the same thing.  They both certainly have overlap in what they do, but they also have enough differences that I don't think they are exactly direct competitors.

 

Also, my initial assessment is that both of them have different weaknesses and both of them seem to fit squarely in the range of useful for the price.  They both seem very useful in forces built using the power-level system.  If you use the exact points then things might tip differently.  Both of them seem pretty close in that situation, but I have not really examined the prices of the full army as a whole.  

 

But I will be frank in that I am heavily leaning to preferring power-level as an army building tool right now.  Originally I was not on board with the power-level system and preferred points.  But the more I have looked at the rules and the various armies the more that the idea of power-level is growing on me.  I think that will facilitate the types of games I want to play more than agonizing over micro-managing costs down to the thousandths fraction of a force.


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#15
Choppanob

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Wazboms are great, inho. Because they do not suffer penalties from using Heavy Weapons (as is the Smasha Gun), so although it's a 1/3 chance to hit the target, you're using two dice when wounding the target. The most probable roll on a 2d6 is 7, and most multi-wounded targets out there tend to be 8, so it's pretty possible to wound something with the Smasha Gun. Considering it's AP-4 and does D6 damage, this weapon shines against those type of models. It could also be pretty nasty against multiwounded models with a somehow low Toughness value, like Nobz, Tyranid Warriors, Ogryns, and the like. 
The Wazbom Mega Kannon is like a downgraded version of the Kustom Mega Kannon, albeit it can be as dangerous to the bearer as the KMK. So yup, that's no so good. But Smasha Gunz are, specially in Mek Gun batteries. 

 

Sorry, a little late on this post.

 

But i got my Wazbom Blastajet from the mailman today, and while looking at the stats for the flyer i saw that besides the "no penalty" for moving with heavy weapons, you also get a +1 to hit with the Smasha Gun if you shoot against a single enemy unit.

 

So it is a pretty good gun to shoot with, but i'm still figuring out the rest of the options for it.

And how to build my other flyer that i got in the mail, but i love magnetizing stuff and maybe i can switch Flyers with 1 model.


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#16
PhillyT

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I still like the dakka jet better as a whole.  So many S6 shots at 4+, thats going to be an incredibly flexible option.


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#17
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I still like the dakka jet better as a whole.  So many S6 shots at 4+, thats going to be an incredibly flexible option.

 

True, and i'm going to build my second flyer as a dakkajet.

 

But i'm also putting a plan op paper to see if ik can turn the Dakka jet into a Burna and Blitza bommer with some magnets and tweaking.

For the Wabom Blastajet it's too much work and difference in look to make that work.


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#18
PhillyT

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I just went and looked at the Wazbom.  Sick model!


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#19
CannibalBob

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I just went and looked at the Wazbom.  Sick model!

 

It looks like they have consolidated all of the flyers into the single Wazbom kit since that one was just the same kit with an upgrade sprue.  If you look on the website it shows the same sprues for all of the flyers.

 

Looks like a good way to get extra bits for Mek Guns rather than buying that single expensive Mek Gun model.


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#20
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I used my Blitza bommer in 2 games over the weekend. It was the star of both games, killing beakies and dark panzies with every bigbomm. No rolling to hit, just roll 10 D6, mortal wounds on 4 +. :D  The supashootas were just bonus.  Right now it is a must take.