Using Tileans in standard Mordheim?, plus more questions! Options

[GuRu]

Me and my brother are gonna start playing Mordheim by first buying the boxed set and settle with the starter models for a while until we get a good grasp of the game. After that I want to try a Tilean warband, since the fluff and modeling possibilities are awesome. So basically, can I use the Lustria Tilean warband in regular games of mordheim?

EDIT: Yes I'm aware that they're unnoficial either way, but I just want to know if there's any rule conflicts between the two that would make them uncompatible. And if they are compatble, are they highly over/under-powered to an extent where they wouldn't be fun for me or my opponent to play? Since of course, we all know that fan made rules are usually a bit biased and in need of heavy playtesting.

EDIT: Ah hell, I might as well milk this post for all my needs. What should I rep the plastic humans that come in the box as? One of the mercenary bands or something else like ostlanders and the other many human factions present? Just wanting to have a good balance of fun and rules balance with them.

[Gashbad]

Figure it shouldn't be a problem to use em in standard games unless it says they HAVE to be used with the lustria rules, which i doubt since I've heard of some of the later warbands (ie lustria, khemri) warbands being used in normal games before

[Kaptun Krum]

Ultimately its up to your campaign organizer to decide what is legal and what isn't. Of course, sometimes some players sneak in lists and start playing w/o organizer approval and then what are you left to do.

Anyways, my only issue with tilleans is the pike rules so far. I think that the pikes are a bit over the top. You go first period. No exceptions or what not. Granted though, I think that if you have some magical spell though that allows you to go first then that should take precedence, its magic after all, but anything mundane always go second compared to the pike.

[GuRu]

Okay then, tileans are off the list. What about ostlanders?

[Scarpia]

I use pikes (I play DoW in regular fantasy), and I disagree with krum on this one - arguably the most ott weapon is the crossbow, not a pike. And pikes only go first if charged - not if they charge.

that's why I sometimes use Pirazzo's Lost legion - they have both pikes and crossbows!!!

[Kaptun Krum]

Well if your charging its a pretty safe bet that you are going to go first, but thats a moot point.

A little divergence from the topic, but I think that the crossbow is alot less OTT than some of the other blackpowder weapons. Like say the blunderbuss. Hmmm, don't have to roll to hit. Everything within 16 inches in a straight line takes a STR 3 hit. If your opponent has a grouping of guys together this could prove to be pretty fatal and can incorporate a win with just one shot.

Give it to a guy with sprint and leap and it becomes even nastier.

[GuRu]

I heard there's no point to taking a non-blunderbuss firearm when you can just get a crossbow. Is that right?

[Kaptun Krum]

personal preference. My opinion is that I would stick with either a crossbow, blunderbuss or a hochland long rifle (not sure on the spelling).

Not being able to move and shoot is a seriously less penalty than say shooting every turn, which is why the crossbow is a better investment than other blackpowder weapons.

The thing that is good with the blunderbuss, is like I said, for only one shot, it does have the potential to do a whole lot of damage. Plus not having to hit is a HUGE advantage as well, especially if you only have a normal BS, cause you will normally need 5-6s to hit for a majority of the game.

The hochland is good because it has great range. You should NEVER be out of range of that weapon, and you can pick your target instead of the closest one. That way people that are getting screened aren't an issue. Thats a pretty big plus if you ask me.

[GuRu]

Damn that's lame, I wanted to include some for a more renaissance based gang. So what about gangs for starting? Marienburgers seem fun, a bit like the badmoons of mordheim.

[Kaptun Krum]

If I was going to play humans I would definitely have played marienburgers, but that was due to our campaign goal of getting to a warband of 300. having the extra cash would have allowed me to get more guys to accomplish that goal. 100 gcs can go quite far if you want it to.

[Scarpia]

A little divergence from the topic, but I think that the crossbow is alot less OTT than some of the other blackpowder weapons.  Like say the blunderbuss.  Hmmm, don't have to roll to hit. Everything within 16 inches in a straight line takes a STR 3 hit.  If your opponent has a grouping of guys together this could prove to be pretty fatal and can incorporate a win with just one shot.

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well you may have me on this one - I've only faced a warband with a blunderbus once, and he was quickly brougt down by crossbows - but I can see your point.

I still don't think the pikes are all that meneacing in mordheim though. The striking first really counts more in WFB, when you can mass them, and you get to not only fight first, but in 4 ranks!

[Kaptun Krum]

well you may have me on this one - I've only faced a warband with a blunderbus once, and he was quickly brougt down by crossbows    - but I can see your point.

I still don't think the pikes are all that meneacing in mordheim though. The striking first really counts more in WFB, when you can mass them, and you get to not only fight first, but in 4 ranks!
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Well that guy was an idiot for leaving him out unprotected, but thats neither here nor there.

But aren't pikes cheaper than spears? I just remember something specific other than just always striking first that bothered me about them. Well thats one thing definitely, is not having the rules handy for them. I don't really like to allow things that aren't readily accessable by everyone in the campaign. people are doing it and it really sucks because they pull out this equipment that you didn't know anything about but yet were supposed to because its listed in some town cryer magazine that only one person has access to. That puts an unfair advantage in that person's court and is something you want to not do in a campaign.

I would stay away from any warband that is not available on the website. Thats just my personal preference for playing as noone should not really have an excuse for not knowing something that is available on the website, especially when the rules are located there.

[Scarpia]

I'm not sure on the mordheim cost of pikes, but the rest are all good points krum - especially from a campaign organization standpoint.

I don't really like to allow things that aren't readily accessable by everyone in the campaign. people are doing it and it really sucks because they pull out this equipment that you didn't know anything about but yet were supposed to because its listed in some town cryer magazine that only one person has access to. That puts an unfair advantage in that person's court and is something you want to not do in a campaign.

I would stay away from any warband that is not available on the website. Thats just my personal preference for playing as noone should not really have an excuse for not knowing something that is available on the website, especially when the rules are located there.

Sort of like the 40k klans.....

[Kaptun Krum]

silly buck toofed git - if you want to go with a more shooty type army, I'd go with reiklenders personally. Getting the extra BS for your marksmen is going to be a whole lot more valuable to you than some extra cash that you get at the beginning for the marienbergers.

I took a look at the blackbowder weapons and with the exception of the blunderbuss and the hochland why on earth would you take anything else? The hangun compared to the crossbow.

Both STR 4
handgun has extra -1 save modifier

crossbow has 6 inch longer range

crossbow and handgun are move or fire weapons

handgun takes one full turn to reload

handgun costs more and is a rare find.
crossbow is common

It seems to me that the handgun has alot more disadvantages to it that bonuses. Plus with the cost factor involved, why on earth would you play with a handgun?

[Jolly_ork]

It's true that hand guns are useless.

I find that two crossbows and two long bows do very well. The long bows run forward, providing longe range support for everything, while also protecting the crossbows as they find good sit n shoot positions. Then the cross bows unlesh the strong dakka and the bows go up n help out the other 5 boys that that are fighting.

i play middenhaiemers so this might seem wierd, but i find that the bowman still fight good with daggers.

Also, giving the hero's flails makes them really menacing because of the huge strength bonus.